[Dark Seraph Lumine]

Okay, now, ever since Lumine became my second favorite character (after "X series" Zero), who will always remain #1 , or maybe Zero would be my #0 favorite, and Lumine could have place #1 ) anyway, I have been wondering, if Lumine had stayed a good guy, and you rescued him at the end of X8, what do you think the final Sigma battle would be like? We KNOW for a fact, that there would be AT LEAST TWO Sigma battles at the end of X8 if we did not have to fight Lumine, right? Well, what do you think Sigma's final form would be like, if the story had stayed on track to rescue Lumine and defeat two forms of Sigma? I suppose there would be a possibility of a "Seraph Sigma" battle for the final form of Sigma, and I am betting a Seraph Sigma would have been an even tougher battle than Seraph Lumine, because, for one reason, Sigma is way bigger than Lumine, and would probably be a lot harder to avoid when he swooped down at you, add that to all of the tricks Seraph Lumine does, and I believe you are in for a fairly harder battle. (I really wish this could have been how the story went, and Lumine could have been spared)


So, what do you think the end of X8 would have been like, if you just had to rescue Lumine, instead of fighting him?

[MythosZero]

Personally I like the fact that there was a different final boss after like 8 games, but if they did stick with sigma, I guess they would have to put alot more effort into to it, The second form would probably be Extremely hard and be giant as it always usually is in the other games, but yeah id rather stick to fighting lumine.

[Oakie620]

... The topic title suggests that Lumine wasn't intended to make a heel turn at an early point of development, when there is no evidence whatsoever to infer that. The only known change that I recall is the removal of Lumine's claim that Sigma won't return, thus keeping Sigma's fate ambiguous.

Dark Seraph Lumine, on 27 June 2012 - 05:35 AM, said:

So, what do you think the end of X8 would have been like, if you just had to rescue Lumine, instead of fighting him?

As I see it, it would have been an uncreative and plain ending: the betrayal of a new generation Reploid is essential for the story, as it corroborates their ideals and free will, supporting Alia's conclusion that the new generation isn't under Sigma's control. Without this twist, the entire point of the climax is lost, and the new generation Reploids come off as puppets like so many old models had been, rendering their existence pointless.

[Flame]

You already fight Sigma 2 times.

Once aboard Gateway Station,

Then on the Moon.

Capcom is sneaky like that.

Also, yeah- topic title is misleading there, DSL.

And agreed with Oakie, woulda been a sorta bland game without the new Gen plot. That plot is the ONLY thing that holds X8 up. if it werent for it, the game would just be a bad game.

[Zednanreh]

Since Simga battle is on Moon, which it mean second battle will be in space, perhaps same body as first one but more flame and size as Galactus from Marvel vs Capcom 3.

Dark Seraph Lumine, on 27 June 2012 - 05:35 AM, said:

So, what do you think the end of X8 would have been like, if you just had to rescue Lumine, instead of fighting him?

I don't know how can I imagine its ending, but.... Possible Lumine will be our boss in X9 even if Sigma send "last" simga virus into Lumine body. =P




Edit:

Flame, on 27 June 2012 - 03:24 PM, said:

You already fight Sigma 2 times.

... What?? But that first one is copy body of generation Replois? Or am I lost something?

[Metal X]

If there was no Lumine double-cross plot twist at the end of the game, I agree, the game WOULD be very predictable and eh...

BUT...

I have a feeling an Ultimate Final Sigma would look something like Final Form Abyss...



I even made sure Megaman was fighting him, so we can get a feel of what the battle might be like.

[RaviorStygian]

Flame, on 27 June 2012 - 03:24 PM, said:

That plot is the ONLY thing that holds X8 up. if it werent for it, the game would just be a bad game.

How so? The gameplay is solid and the music awesome.

Just because the story sucks doesn't mean the game sucks. Just look at X6.

[CX111]

RaviorStygian, on 27 June 2012 - 06:59 PM, said:

How so? The gameplay is solid and the music awesome.

Just because the story sucks doesn't mean the game sucks. Just look at X6.

Diddo. I actually hated the fact they made Sigma look like a chum. As much of a jerk as he is, he shouldn't be naive enough to get used. It's not consistent with his character development. It's his job to use others. I would have preferred it if Sigma was absent entirely. He seems really out of place in the plot.

[volt-kid]

I was very disappointed that Sigma didn't have an alternative form like he always use to. And hey, I agree that he too would make a cool devilish resemblance, but not a seraph since that was Lumine's. He was mostly like a dark angel with the wings and halo. Sigma is more manly, so he needs to have a more monstrous form. Meaning: A devil. The form was like that, but I mean a much larger and more devilish looking form. If you're still wondering, ask Sigma himself. He's on the boards now.

After you beat him in Easy Mode, you then go straight to the credits. But if that weren't the case, then why would Lumine's appearance stop Sigma from evolving? Two forms of Sigma and then two forms of Lumine would sweet.

[Flame]

Quote

... What?? But that first one is copy body of generation Replois? Or am I lost something?

Copy indeed. But you still fight 2 different "Sigma" battles in X8. It' just a little unconventional since there's a stage between them.

And while Sigma's moon form may be his true X8 form, X8 rides on the pseudo X1 Copy-Sigma design as Sigma for most of the game. so you cpould consider, in a technical sense, Copy Sigma the fist fight, and moon Sigma as the second "bigger badder better" form.

thats why i said Capcom is sneaky like that. One might think, "I only fight Sigma once in X8? blasphemy!" but in the end, you actually fought him twice all along. It just so happens that the first fight is an impostor.

Quote

How so? The gameplay is solid and the music awesome.

Well- opinion territory is being treaded here, but I disagree. the stage design was terrible and had very little replay to it. Trilobyte doesnt even have a complete stage, but HALF of one which you go through twice. The best stages are Antonion and Optic Sunflower's and maybe Pandemonium's. The problem with X8's stages is they rely too much on gimmicking to make up for actual stage. ride chasers, gravity hijinx, giant robot chasing you and running away from you, a series of ranked minigame challenges, metal gear X... etc.

And they just thrust everything that you normally find in stages, into a shop and called it a day. Im amazed they didnt throw armor parts in there too, but they probably only didnt because they require Dr. Light.

Quote

Just because the story sucks doesn't mean the game sucks. Just look at X6.

You misunderstand- the plot is fine, the plot is good. the GAME is bad.

as for the music, it just felt too samey to me. too much guitar and rock. not too many of the tracks stood out to me.

X8 just played it way too safe.

[RaviorStygian]

Well I guess we just disagree then. I personally have no problems with X8. All the things you listed about the stages don't really bug me too much. I like variety.

[volt-kid]

Flame, on 28 June 2012 - 01:28 AM, said:

Well- opinion territory is being treaded here, but I disagree. the stage design was terrible and had very little replay to it. Trilobyte doesnt even have a complete stage, but HALF of one which you go through twice. The best stages are Antonion and Optic Sunflower's and maybe Pandemonium's. The problem with X8's stages is they rely too much on gimmicking to make up for actual stage. ride chasers, gravity hijinx, giant robot chasing you and running away from you, a series of ranked minigame challenges, metal gear X... etc.

I agree with this. I like to look for secrets hidden in the levels. While many items were well hidden, ones like in the snow monster's stage were very obvious. If the level designs were more thought out, then I would love this game. Anyway, you mentioned that Optic Sunflower has one of the good stages. Don't you see that as being a mini game challenge too?

Flame, on 28 June 2012 - 01:28 AM, said:

And they just thrust everything that you normally find in stages, into a shop and called it a day. Im amazed they didnt throw armor parts in there too, but they probably only didnt because they require Dr. Light.

I actually like this new feature. The items to unlock them were still hidden in the levels, it forces you to collect metals, and now each of the heroes' lives can be increased evenly. Ya know what Ima sayin?

[Metal X]

Volt-Kid, on 28 June 2012 - 05:33 PM, said:

I actually like this new feature. The items to unlock them were still hidden in the levels, it forces you to collect metals, and now each of the heroes' lives can be increased evenly. Ya know what Ima sayin?

This is true... Still, I miss collecting hearts.

[Flame]

Quote

Don't you see that as being a mini game challenge too?

Oh yeah, dont get me wrong, that was a gimmick and the minigame challenge I was referring to- but it's well done, since the replay in that stage revolves around actually getting all the ranks and trying to get the best rank you can, consistently, so you can get better rewards at the end. And the little bit of stage in between challenges was well done enough.

I liked Antonion's stage because due to the gravity gimmick, it actually had more stage to it. It was FUN. in just one room, you had like 2 different stage sections.

Quote

I actually like this new feature. The items to unlock them were still hidden in the levels, it forces you to collect metals, and now each of the heroes' lives can be increased evenly. Ya know what Ima sayin?

That's the problem. if you were going to scatter the items NEEDED to craft parts, why not just hide the parts? the issue was that only for weapons and special parts did you ever need rare metals. for the rest just collecting metals was enough, which was stupid, because it makes you grind. And the only thing you should ever have to grind for is health and ammo.

thats another thing. health and ammo drops were ridiculously rare. all enemies dropped were metals, adding to the alienness of the game compared to previous X titles.

[RaviorStygian]

I actually like the metal system too, and all of the collectibles.

I just love X8. I've put over 30 hours into my one file.

[Hellfangwolf]

Flame, on 28 June 2012 - 01:28 AM, said:

Copy indeed. But you still fight 2 different "Sigma" battles in X8. It' just a little unconventional since there's a stage between them.

And while Sigma's moon form may be his true X8 form, X8 rides on the pseudo X1 Copy-Sigma design as Sigma for most of the game. so you cpould consider, in a technical sense, Copy Sigma the fist fight, and moon Sigma as the second "bigger badder better" form.

thats why i said Capcom is sneaky like that. One might think, "I only fight Sigma once in X8? blasphemy!" but in the end, you actually fought him twice all along. It just so happens that the first fight is an impostor.


Well- opinion territory is being treaded here, but I disagree. the stage design was terrible and had very little replay to it. Trilobyte doesnt even have a complete stage, but HALF of one which you go through twice. The best stages are Antonion and Optic Sunflower's and maybe Pandemonium's. The problem with X8's stages is they rely too much on gimmicking to make up for actual stage. ride chasers, gravity hijinx, giant robot chasing you and running away from you, a series of ranked minigame challenges, metal gear X... etc.

And they just thrust everything that you normally find in stages, into a shop and called it a day. Im amazed they didnt throw armor parts in there too, but they probably only didnt because they require Dr. Light.


You misunderstand- the plot is fine, the plot is good. the GAME is bad.

as for the music, it just felt too samey to me. too much guitar and rock. not too many of the tracks stood out to me.

X8 just played it way too safe.

Why are saying levels are too gimmicking? Cause very many of the other games at least the ones that I've played or watched always had a gimmick that tends to link it self to the Maverick. For example: Cyber Peacock's stage in X4 it's very much like Optic Sunflower's being that they're part of a training sort. In Cyber Peacock's you try and out run the clock and get S ranks through the sections to get I think it was a sub tank and a heart at the end and now interjecting into putting stuff in shops they could've used that since the very beginning you still have to find the metals to use the items it's not like clearing so much of the game unlocks all the items, so yea I don't get why you say it's a bad game, but like you said it's all a matter of one's thoughts.

[Flame]

The issue is that X8 uses gimmicks to make up for bland stage design. And while they may be interesting gimmicks, theya re too easy to see past,and not always implemented as well as they could be.

[Metal X]

Honestly... the "gimmicks" don't bother me.

I'm even sort of okay with Avalanche Yeti's stage...

But I absolutely HATE. HATE. HATED, Gigabolt Man-o-war's stage.

[RaviorStygian]

Metal Man X, on 29 June 2012 - 10:04 PM, said:

But I absolutely HATE. HATE. HATED, Gigabolt Man-o-war's stage.

I did at first too, but it's a lot easier now.

[Metal X]

It's not about being easy or difficult. It's the principle of the thing!!

The Mega Man (X) franchise has ALWAYS been about Platform-based Side Scrolling.

Once X7 came into play Capcom had a Panic-attack at how to incorporate modern 3D Gaming with the old traditional outset, and come time to... try again with X8, they really fixed a lot of things. And I mean a lot... But they still inevitably fucked things up with Yeti's & Man-o-War's stages. I think they were starting to feel like they had to do a mandatory 3D element component to keep up with the times.

But in my opinion. They definitely didn't...

As for the other stages, I'm completely fine with the Booster Forest - Bamboo Pandamonium stage. I loved trying to keep stealth in Dark Mantis' stage. Optic Sun Flower's stage was sweet. I really felt like I was breaking into a Security Complex. The Waste Compactor thing for Burn Rooster's stage has definitely been done before, but the downward scrolling was a really nice challenge, and I absolutely loved that you had to make your way back up before teleporting out of there! We've already discussed the novelty of changing Gravity in Antonion's stage. And lastly, I quite enjoyed the little Mechaniloid chase that was Earthrock Trilobyte's stage. It had a very... Illumina from X6 vibe to it, only with a much better - interactive Sub-Boss battle.

So that said. X8 definitely wasn't a Fail at Stage Design in my opinion. They tried a bunch of newer challenges and added a bunch of shop/upgrades, to force replay value... But other than that, I loved it. Those Inter-Mission's were interesting. I didn't much like the Crab one at Noah's Park... but that's mainly only there for grinding purposes, and to bring back the good ole' "Can you beat your high score?? " element that many new games are lacking.

Alright, that's enough on X8 rambling for me... For now...